Playing efficiently

[Pluton]

by LoW from Dynasty Saga

Playing efficiently

This is what I always believe what makes people be on top. With playing efficient, you could bypass any VIP players and be stronger than them (except VIP10 who spends 10k$USD continuously). Remember this game is keep going (no level restriction). If you reach lvl 110 faster, you will bully lvl 100. By the time they reach lvl 110, you should reach lvl 111 (passing another campaign) or at least having lvl 110 maxed. You will always be stronger. The incremental in DS is exponentially. Therefore, the more you stay in that level (don't want to level up), the more you will be left behind.

Try to you enhance only what you need to enhance. Try not missing any SMW. Dont waste drachmas!!

Train only useful heroes!! If you think you will ditch him, dont spend too much on him (like max renn or double wash or such).

Anyway, all of these could be achieve without playing 24/7. Just go online for elite reset (for legion battle and elite) and determine when the crop/refine price will be high. Crop move about ~0.7 per 30 minutes. So, just estimate when it will be high and then online for 1 minutes to sell Crops and then go off ^^

Lastly, do make friends and enjoy the game
When you have difficulties, go to forum and try find a solution.
Hope some of you could benefit for reading all of these ^^


From Dynasty Saga Walkthrough (whole guide)


Level 117 (ViP 4) vs Level 130 (VIP 10?)

[Orochi]

(12-14-2011, 10:27 PM)Pluton Wrote: by LoW from Dynasty Saga

Playing efficiently

This is what I always believe what makes people be on top. With playing efficient, you could bypass any VIP players and be stronger than them. Remember this game is keep going (no level restriction). If you reach lvl 110 faster, you will bully lvl 100. By the time they reach lvl 110, you should reach lvl 111 (passing another campaign) or at least having lvl 110 maxed. You will always be stronger. The incremental in DS is exponentially. Therefore, the more you stay in that level (don't want to level up), the more you will be left behind.

i already disagree totally with the first paragraph.. to begin with a low vip playing as efficiently as a non vip will have a lot more advantages, and a high vip playing non-efficiently still has the gold n options to make a ton of mistakes and yet be faster and stronger.

The other part is also very contradictory.. true the higher and faster u level, the stronger u will be in comparison to a low level person. BUT as a low or non vip, if u try to level asap, u'll suffer from a total lack of laurels. at some stage u WILL be forced to camp to farm laurels.. camping to farm laurels will be the efficient way. so u won't be able to level up as fast as vips who can afford to use gold for training n washes.

and the higher the level, the bigger the gap. even renning alone will set u back a couple of weeks difference.

[Pluton]

(12-15-2011, 03:07 AM)Orochi Wrote: i already disagree totally with the first paragraph.. to begin with a low vip playing as efficiently as a non vip will have a lot more advantages, and a high vip playing non-efficiently still has the gold n options to make a ton of mistakes and yet be faster and stronger.

The other part is also very contradictory.. true the higher and faster u level, the stronger u will be in comparison to a low level person. BUT as a low or non vip, if u try to level asap, u'll suffer from a total lack of laurels. at some stage u WILL be forced to camp to farm laurels.. camping to farm laurels will be the efficient way. so u won't be able to level up as fast as vips who can afford to use gold for training n washes.

and the higher the level, the bigger the gap. even renning alone will set u back a couple of weeks difference.

Are you comparing end game?

And what do you mean by a lot more advantages?

The difference between vip0 and vip4: (67$)

Training speed:
2 more training spaces: lets say 50 trans/day
vip0 = 24x3+50x1.3=137
vip4 = 24x5+50x1.3=185 (1.35x faster)
This is the least of your worry unless you're Athenian. Zeus doesn't need tons of heroes.

Washing: Below lv 120-130, not very important. If you know how to wash, laurels does the job well. (luck)

Levies: Both can go up to 9-10g levies while maintaining gold amount, but vip4 might do less if they spend more gold on training.

Builders: Worthless as they not building anything most of the time at lv 100+.
All other features doesn't matter, except purple book, red horn (not needed for Zeus)

I should say that efficiency means camp at lv 87, 117, 127, etc, not stay at lv 110, nor jump to lv 120 asap.
Where does it say to level up asap?
VIP4 seems good, anything beyond that doesn't make much difference unless you waste 10-20$ per day, which is not worth.


The difference between vip0-4 and vip6+: (1000$-20000$USD) ...
You said yourself:

Quote:don't talk about efficiency with a high vip player, because they simply dont care about efficiency. why else would they spend THAT much? simply because they can, and they dont need to be a good player to beat others,

True
So let's not compare how Orochi and other good players would beat the game many months faster than others with unlimited $$, but compare to actual high VIPs that don't care about efficiency.

~3nd, 4th, 5th, 7th player (high VIP) to overkill Anubis with $$ finished Lost Temple "~slower" than VIP1 Trimgor.
#1 mrbuttslap was efficient until lv 130 (heroes not max 130 renn)
#2 Trimgor vip1
#6 Third ~vip4 but not sure

High VIPs being faster/stronger? Easy to do.
High VIP = 2x faster? not true for now. The cost $$ in this game to save time is exponential.

[Orochi]

true, amount of money needed to be spent to access high vip options, and the gold it takes to make use of those options, is not linear. it's a HUGE amount. that's y i recommend ppl to stop at vip3-4 ( 3 =free plat wash, 4 = able to buy red horns). the rest of the better options come at vip 8 and higher. so if one can't afford to get to vip 8, there's no real reason to go pass vip 4 if we're talking about cost efficiency.

but then again, i was talking about high vips who dont care about cost effectiveness, ppl who can spend hundreds of gold a day to get extra chests, ppl who can spend hundreds of gold a day to get 5-10 extra refines, ppl who can spend hundreds of gold a day washing and training, ppl who can spend hundreds of gold a day on comissioning, ppl who can spend hundred of gold a day buying divs.. etcetc... u get the picture.

those ppl probably spend more gold in a week or two, than i've spent in my entire batheo life. they will always be ahead unless they stop spending. i know i'm playing efficiently, but i also recognize the limits when chasing high vips. there's no way to chase that few thousand dollar gap. and when 140 maps come out, the gap will get even wider.

ultimately it doesnt matter, a vip 0 can have as much fun playing as a vip 10. there's no reason to spend if u don't want to. but my point is simply

Quote:With playing efficient, you could bypass any VIP players and be stronger than them.

is not true. there will be some players u can't catch no matter how efficient u are. u probably can bypass them if u spent 1/10th of what they have, but if u don't want to, that's a moot point.

[Prabhu]

IMHO, "playing efficient" is one axis and "playing as VIP/non-VIP" is another axis entirely. Here is a quick summary of 4 categories:

VIP10 + Highly efficient(efficient as both of you, for example) = Gods of Batheo. They can finish a new map within a month of its release LOL.

VIP0 + Highly efficient = Good at Batheo, but shud have the patience to survive the difficulties to be faced. For example, a 700k enhance failing at 99%, fully groomed Heph/Asteria still not giving the power punch cuz no enchant thru red horn, etc.

VIP10 + Least Efficient = You think bad? no, they are still 'Good at Batheo'!! They can prove to be highly inefficient and still get to beat category #2, which can be hard to digest but is a frank truth.

VIP0 + Least Efficient = time passers, probably should find another game ;-)

If the advantage from VIP0 to VIP4 is 1x, advantage from VIP4 to VIP10 would be 10x or higher.

So, let's not assume a VIP0 to be highly efficient always and a VIP10 to be highly in-efficient always and make a comparison of the two.

Apart from all these, the importance of starting early on a server and playing efficiently at the same time should be considered too. For example, MrB started out on a new server with a clear cut plan of what he is going to do and did it(IMO). A funnier case can be my own. I started off on S10(when a lot of later servers were available) simply cuz I liked the name 'JEWEL' LOL. Also for the first 3-4 months, I was loading batheo page to time pass whenever I got stuck on Cityville LOL. Not even regularly! Still, I wanted to suggest Batheo that they can add sound to the battle animation page ;-) Now, tell me is it even possible for me to get past sm1 of my VIP level who has been playing efficiently since day one of the start of server?

Guess it all comes down to one thing - what do u want from the game? fun? do u get it? yes, play on! or no, quit Batheo!! Is this a race? no, hang on! or yes, get frustrated over simple things and lose the fun factor completely.

Guess that's the end of my rantings, pls don't delete this post or move to a "Rantings" section LOL

[Timgor]

hmmmm, i have something to say
i'd much agree with Orochi
a high vip has enough gold to make up for their mistake,and as taotie said, the most different gap is the hero washing between a vip and a non-vip.in the begining term,since most of heros are merey single washed ,even a non-vip could use laurels to wash hero which may narrow the gap between a non-vip and a vip3 or vip4,hower, then a vip8 or above is involved ,they can afford a amount of golds to train and wash the unnecessary heros,therefore, they still push the map far more than a non-vip thanks to the fact that they don't have to camp at certain lvl for farming laurels.
in the end term,even the gap expands between a non-vip and vip4,the importance of platinum wash emerges,which will save a tons of laurels when doing double wash,that's to say,they are able to burn divs in more battle to gain gems

Quote: when 140 maps come out, the gap will get even wider.

that's badly true
besides

Quote:Guess it all comes down to one thing - what do u want from the game? fun? do u get it? yes, play on! or no, quit Batheo!! Is this a race? no, hang on! or yes, get frustrated over simple things and lose the fun factor completely.

i think it's right :p

[Pluton]

@Orochi:
That was written by LoW from Dynasty Saga, and isn't about lv 130+ stuff. Because for any player to reach lv 130, they absolutely need time and patience no matter what amount of money they spend. A VIP on my server spend like 10-30$ (1000 gold) per day, and QUIT after ~3-5 months, stuck in the desert at lv 110, with maxed AOE heroes (bull,meteor mage).

WHY do you want to catch High VIPs??? 10/10 win in SMW and still want more?
You're one of the rare players that has passed Siegfried, that's very good.

---

And hell no, High VIPs are never 10x VIP0 Highly efficient players.

(VIP10 + Highly efficient) is AT MOST 2x VIP0 + Highly efficient.
Orochi is just behind High VIPs, not 2x slower than them, because they simple aren't Highly efficient in the first place. "why else would they spend THAT much? simply because they can"


"High VIPs are able to burn divs in more battle to gain gems" no
They are able to maintain permanent M50, sometimes pump up to 700k+ prestige to become King.

---

Look:
High VIPs gain more drachmas > At most 2x more with 20refines, but a part of it goes into max invests.
They can max train max wash all the fancy heroes? Doesn't matter. Limit of 5 hero.
High VIPs don't need laurels,have more divinities > they spend more divinities in PVP for prestige.
You use laurels for washing? They lose prestige from the system.

So you see, they buy more, they use more and lose more, it balances out (except in end game).
But the difference is not HUGE, but the amount they can spend is HUGE, and that's clever part of the devs, and explains the success of the game. (not ClapAlong)

Of course, when high refines, enchants, and triple wash comes in, the game is no more balanced, thus the game dies. (You play another game, and not another games on ClapAlong)

[Guest]

Umm... VIP10 is insanely high.

VIP8's are insanely high IMO. Even VIP7 is excessive unless that gold just went into mass training.

The functional difference between VIP4 and VIP7 is simply the number of heroes the VIP7 has spend gold training up and gold washed. They both have 95% of the tools needed to be top players... but the VIP7 will have more heroes to:
a) experiment with
(i.e. Heimdall's good... and yeah you should pair him with Cronus... but combined with mages who give no moral you get a nearly BM free battle and TEAR through Chilly Mountain and Lost Temple. The VIP4 doesn't have the resources to max train/wash all the heroes needed to find out just how successful things like this are)

b) break a map NPC choke point. I.e. Mnemosyne in Tart can be a nasty choke point, but a rally hero makes it VERY easy. The VIP7 can fast track this training in a day to equip some gear... the VIP maybe has to wait a few days. Same goes for Eurybia and Heimdall who are IMMEDIATELY useful when unlocked and gold training saves a LOT of time

So yes, if the non-VIP, or low-VIP have the benefit of the HIgh-VIP's experience and BRs to knwo what heros will be needed in a month or so... they can advance efficiently.

The goal of high VIPs aren't necessarily to be more efficient...

So ultimately, no, a non-VIP simply can not out run a high VIP in forging through new maps (unless they farm Chinese BRs... again... planning ahead for the few heros they need to pull off map advancement... but thats the same argument I guess... non-VIPs in the Chinese maps will never outrun the high VIPs who have plenty of heroes an gear ready to go from the release of a map).

It doesn't mean non-VIPs are boned for life... we're talking about being #1. If you're ok with being #2 or below in a server of 300+ players... non VIP can be very effective... as long as they plan ahead for the gear/heros they'll need to advance.

For the record.. I'm currently on Nut in Lost Temple... the same one Guderian is on. Only 3 people are past me... all of them much higher VIP than myself... and like Guderian, there are other higher VIPs are are still below me... even though "mages don't map well". smart play even matters at high VIP levels

[Orochi]

Quote:It doesn't mean non-VIPs are boned for life... we're talking about being #1. If you're ok with being #2 or below in a server of 300+ players... non VIP can be very effective... as long as they plan ahead for the gear/heros they'll need to advance.

that's the point i was making. u dont need to be a high vip or even a low vip to be effective. but being effective is different from overtaking a high vip. or being #1. there are limit as to how effective u can be when controlled by a lack of gold + options to use gold on.

Quote:For the record.. I'm currently on Nut in Lost Temple... the same one Guderian is on. Only 3 people are past me... all of them much higher VIP than myself... and like Guderian, there are other higher VIPs are are still below me... even though "mages don't map well". smart play even matters at high VIP levels

pure mage build doesn't map well due to certain chokepoints where no moral sup or no blocker/dodger makes it extremely hard. if at any point of time u used less than 5 mages, then the point about mages not mapping well becomes irrelevant a 2-3 mage build actually fares better in cm/lt and 140 maps than a pure bm build. i'll be taking on 140 maps with no kylin because my focus will be on 2 x mages for my lineup.

i'm the 2nd athenian to finish LT ( i think, not sure if any other athenian on earlier servers has completed lt). the 1st athenian to finish LT is TWICE my vip level, and the only person ahead of me on my server. the rest of the high vips are behind me and only 2 others are at nut (server 15, not one of the earlier servers). thing is all those high vips have more heroes trained and better gear than me, and once i have pushed maps it usually takes them only a week or two to copy my BRs and get to where i am. there will come a point where i simply cannot keep ahead anymore due to gear diff n the additional time i take to ren heroes.

that's the difference between efficiency and the advantages of gold. if the game progresses at a linear pace there won't be an issue staying ahead, but the higher i level, the longer i need to camp for rens, and the longer i have to camp to get drachs and gems for gear ( i havent even STARTED on kylin yet, which i do need to sooner or later.. that'll cut me back at least 2-3 months in progress compared to those already who have kylin).

bottom line.. it's extremely hard to stay ahead of ppl who have bought, and are still buying, thousands of gold more than u, no matter how efficient u are. and when it comes to a point where everyone uses the same heroes (which will happen) and everything depends on gear and enchant and armaments.. that's the end of the road for me lol. (luck plays a huge factor too... but sadly i have none.)

[Pluton]

(12-23-2011, 09:43 AM)Orochi Wrote: i'm the 2nd athenian to finish LT ( i think, not sure if any other athenian on earlier servers has completed lt). the 1st athenian to finish LT is TWICE my vip level, and the only person ahead of me on my server. the rest of the high vips are behind me and only 2 others are at nut (server 15, not one of the earlier servers). thing is all those high vips have more heroes trained and better gear than me, and once i have pushed maps it usually takes them only a week or two to copy my BRs and get to where i am.

Hey Orochi, can you stop misleading the new players?
There are many people TWICE your vip level. But only very little of them have 10k+USD$ to overkill lv 130 boss, and that's 300,000+ more gold, not thousands, because they spend a few thousand gold each week! (3 months = more than 150000 gold spent!)
Only unusual super big spender beat you just by spending 10000+$USD, and that's a very rare player.
All the others who though they could be good just by buying gold (but not enough) aren't top player if they are not efficient in some ways.

Efficient = huge head start at training Anubis and getting much higher refines.

Yes, everyone will use the same heroes, but that's end game, lv 130+.

[Orochi]

how am i misleading new players?

i said i beat most high vips, but there's a limit to who i can beat, and how long i can stay ahead. u really have to stop assuming high vips dont know how to play.. most of them DO know how to play, just that they probably don't have the time to research chinese BRs n forums, so they know less on what heroes to choose.

now, since i teach them which heroes to use and which not to.. how inefficient can they get?

i may start training anubis earlier than them, but they will take less than 1/3 of the time i'll need to ren + wash anubis up. and honestly once u hit 120+... a lot of stuff is luck dependant like aramaments and enchants.. there's hardly any strategy or efficiency left to speak of.

heroes wise.. having same heroes could start as early as 110+. sult and cronus are no brainers. and 130 isnt end game.. 140 150 160 maps still to come.. 130 is just mid game. and now with armaments u'll see a lot more ppl getting to 130 faster