• Forums
  • Items
  • Heroes
  • Maps
  • Levy
  • Guides
  • Battle Reports
  • Ranking
  • Search
  • Help
  • Extras
Forum stats
Show team
View New Posts
View Today's Posts
Ultimate Batheo Athanaton Forum
Login to account Create an account
Login
Username:
Password: Lost Password?
 

  Ultimate Batheo Athanaton Forum Batheo, Athanaton Guides & Walkthrough
« Previous 1 ... 3 4 5 6 7 8 Next »
Effect of Faculty on Damage

Thread Modes
Effect of Faculty on Damage
Pluton Offline
Senior Member
****
Posts: 649
Threads: 365
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 0
#1
10-15-2011, 08:31 PM (This post was last modified: 03-09-2012, 10:00 PM by Pluton.)
Test was on Triton:
At 100% faculty, you do 100% damage.
At ~0-1% faculty, you do ~40-60% damage.

Numbers could be wrong.

Update: Look at post below for more info.
~NON-VIP~ Poseidon - Tartarus - Ragnarok - Beyond the Desert - Chilly Mountain - Lost Temple
Find
Orochi Offline
Junior Member
**
Posts: 32
Threads: 1
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 0
#2
10-17-2011, 03:55 PM
when faculty goes down by X%, damage will drop by (X/2)%, lowest being 50% damage dealt.


Find
SteveForge Offline
Moderator
*****
Posts: 43
Threads: 5
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 0
#3
10-20-2011, 09:01 PM (This post was last modified: 10-20-2011, 09:28 PM by SteveForge.)
(10-17-2011, 03:55 PM)Orochi Wrote: when faculty goes down by X%, damage will drop by (X/2)%, lowest being 50% damage dealt.
Sounds right. Mages seem to have the same impact, though my curves keep coming up a bit higher than 50% for 0 troops. Probably just random chance... but each dot on this chart is a average of 10 to 15 passes with the same faculty (averaged them to 1 point to make linear regression simple).

(10-15-2011, 08:31 PM)Pluton Wrote: Test was on Triton:
At 100% faculty, you do 100% damage.
At ~0-1% faculty, you do ~40-60% damage.

Numbers could be wrong.
Titron's strength at low faculty seems high here. Those posted numbers about C&B and SS changing Coefficient;s of damage vs faculty are suspect now.

The previously posted forum info was:
C&B: 2.5 (100%), 2.0 (75%), 1.6 (50%), 1.2 (20%)

I was under the assumption these changing DAMAGE COEFFICIENTS were independent of the faculty effects on hit strength.
i.e. adjusting for the 50%=0 faculty effect... and normalizing 100% to 1.0 (instead of 2.5) I get:
100% faculty @ 2.5cd = 2.5/2.5*(1.00/2+.5) = 1.00
75% faculty @ 2.0cd = 2.0/2.5*(.75/2+.50) = 0.70
50% faculty @ 1.6cd = 1.6/2.5*(.50/2+.50) = 0.48
20% faculty @ 1.2cd = 1.2/2.5*(.20/2+.50) = 0.28

So 20% faculty C&B attack should have the decreasing damage coefficient AND the decreasing faculty effects and only be 28% as strong as a full strength hit. Clearly that's not the case if Pluton is getting near 0 numbers north of 40%.

My guess? the damage coefficient for Crash and burn is actually fixed at 2.5. The strength drop is due solely to faculty losses... like any other BM?
with a fixed 2.5 CD...
100% @ 2.5 = 1.00 (or 2.5)
75% @ 2.5 = 0.875 (or 2.2)
50% @ 2.5 = 0.75 (or 1.9)
20% @ 2.5 = 0.60 (or 1.5)
0% @ 2.5 = 0.50 (or 1.25)

Is it possible C&B is actually a fixed cD? and that sliding scale we've seen publish is just adjusted for faculty losses? That'd be my guess. C&B is just a fixed 2.5.


Attached Files Thumbnail(s)
   
Find
SteveForge Offline
Moderator
*****
Posts: 43
Threads: 5
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 0
#4
10-20-2011, 10:05 PM
The previously posted forum info was:
CB: 2.5 (100%), 2.0 (75%), 1.6 (50%), 1.2 (20%)
SS: 1.6 (100%), 2.0 (75%), 2.4 (50%), 2.6 (25%)


Here's the data charted out (see attached).

You'll notice that battles start with full faculty (on the right) and move left over the battle. Not only does SS have an advantage in the max damage level (approaches 2.75 cd at 0%), it also does so in mid battle to the end when strong pops can mean a win vs loss. C&B on the other hand would be a decent alternative if it didn't suicide troops.

Looking at these curves I'd assume that Armored Charge (a 2.2 fixed cd) or Soul Taking Arrows (2.0) would have more net effect on most battles compared to C&B.

Hopfully the crash and burn buff will fix its weaknesses. A 15% loss instead of 50%, and a small bump to the CD (say 2.8 max similar to SS) would be in order IMO.

I'd be interested to see the damage curve for continuous C&B and continuous SS laid over top of this data. I assume, like most continous BMs, that the damage is lower than their "pure spirit" BM versions... anyone have a Annubis-Hera double bomber BR? giving them the same faculty and stats could be possible... that'd make it real interesting.


Attached Files Thumbnail(s)
   
Find
Pluton Offline
Senior Member
****
Posts: 649
Threads: 365
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 0
#5
10-20-2011, 10:41 PM
Nice Info Steve!

Yea, C&B coefficient should be fixed. I updated the BM coefficient for C&B.
~NON-VIP~ Poseidon - Tartarus - Ragnarok - Beyond the Desert - Chilly Mountain - Lost Temple
Find
Prabhu Offline
Member
***
Posts: 75
Threads: 5
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 0
#6
10-25-2011, 09:36 PM (This post was last modified: 10-25-2011, 09:38 PM by Prabhu.)
I've not followed the numbers carefully but I would like to add my 2 cents this way -

1. You get Anubis first and then the continuous C&B hero. Simply put C&B > SS. A 1 shot kill at start of battle is far more reliable than the one towards end (which is very risky!)

2. Towards late game, I guess healer becomes mandatory for any build. Healer works counter-productive with SS heroes, however the same healer works perfectly complementing a C&B hero.

Just some logical thoughts, I just feel C&B is the 'future tense' of SS Smile All these lead me to the conclusion that Triton + Asclepius (or the late game healer) is going to be the best combo ever! Triton's troop type is already super-cool. His BM is way over-powered and that's gonna get buffed up :-| This 'buffing up' a hero usually happens to encourage more players to use those heroes lol (at least, from what I have observed in other games Smile)
Find
Pluton Offline
Senior Member
****
Posts: 649
Threads: 365
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 0
#7
10-26-2011, 09:33 PM (This post was last modified: 11-04-2011, 07:46 PM by Pluton.)
I just lost 50%HP after Triton's every BM, but I guess that's because of 0 wash and not good enough spirit defense...

We'll see much later what Triton can do...




~NON-VIP~ Poseidon - Tartarus - Ragnarok - Beyond the Desert - Chilly Mountain - Lost Temple
Find
gombe Offline
New Member
*
Posts: 2
Threads: 0
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 0
#8
10-29-2011, 09:55 PM
nice one thanks for the info guys
U GET STRONG IN TIME
[Image: smetjn.jpg]
Find
Evilness Offline
Junior Member
**
Posts: 32
Threads: 7
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 0
#9
11-04-2011, 06:05 PM
Prabhu you are complety wrong here. Notice that SS damage becomes higher then C&B under 75% faculty. It is very hard to keep hero over 75% half of the battle if he damages himself, which means SS has better average damage. The second benefit is that SS can be an excelent tank due the the fact damage increases with less faculty. And thirdly you are wrong about the healer. Unlike C&B, SS hero is always placed in front and extra heal can just increase survivalability. Most of the battle unit is still under 75% faculty and does more damage then C&B
Find
Guest
Unregistered
 
#10
12-26-2011, 06:59 PM
Is there a difference between a maia(or any hero) with 100% faculty (8000 troops) vs an exact same maia with 100%faculty with 11k troops as far as damage goes?
Orochi Offline
Junior Member
**
Posts: 32
Threads: 1
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 0
#11
12-27-2011, 06:34 AM
no. damage is based on the % left of your faculty, higher maximum faculty doesnt give more damage.
Find
Goldmember Offline
Junior Member
**
Posts: 26
Threads: 3
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 0
#12
12-27-2011, 01:36 PM
Higher faculty though is generally attributable to better troop grade which does increase damage.
Find
Orochi Offline
Junior Member
**
Posts: 32
Threads: 1
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 0
#13
12-27-2011, 02:29 PM
(12-27-2011, 01:36 PM)Goldmember Wrote: Higher faculty though is generally attributable to better troop grade which does increase damage.
no... troop grade has NO effect on faculty. higher hero LEVEL = high faculty.

eg lv 90 G12 hero "X", will have less faculty than lv 91 G9 hero "X".
Find
Goldmember Offline
Junior Member
**
Posts: 26
Threads: 3
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 0
#14
12-27-2011, 04:42 PM
I guess I didn't phrase that correctly...meant the same thing just said it wrong. Smile
Find
Prabhu Offline
Member
***
Posts: 75
Threads: 5
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 0
#15
01-25-2012, 03:39 PM (This post was last modified: 01-25-2012, 03:47 PM by Prabhu.)
(11-04-2011, 06:05 PM)Evilness Wrote: Prabhu you are complety wrong here. Notice that SS damage becomes higher then C&B under 75% faculty. It is very hard to keep hero over 75% half of the battle if he damages himself, which means SS has better average damage. The second benefit is that SS can be an excelent tank due the the fact damage increases with less faculty. And thirdly you are wrong about the healer. Unlike C&B, SS hero is always placed in front and extra heal can just increase survivalability. Most of the battle unit is still under 75% faculty and does more damage then C&B
Well, it's pretty late for me to see this thread. SS heroes are more commonly used(even I used Hemera for quite a while now) compared to C&B heroes. The point is we haven't seen the comparison coming from someone who is in 140 maps or beyond and who says C&B is useless compared to SS(after trying both ofc). Otherwise, it's only our estimates. AFAIK C&B comes into picture only in later part compared to SS.

Healer being counter-productive to SS heroes is something you have to try and see, numbers aren't totally conclusive.

(12-26-2011, 06:59 PM)Guest Wrote: Is there a difference between a maia(or any hero) with 100% faculty (8000 troops) vs an exact same maia with 100%faculty with 11k troops as far as damage goes?
When Maia has the same faculty percent in both cases(say 100%), there is no difference in damage output.

Now, if Maia takes say 6k damage, first Maia will end up with 25% faculty and second Maia will end up with 50% faculty(approx.). Now the damage output will be different - higher faculty will be able to dish out higher damage.
Find
Share Thread:            


Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Damage increases as the fight progresses Pluton 9 13 402 06-22-2012, 06:43 PM
Last Post: Prabhu
  BM Damage Coefficient! Pluton 6 14 755 05-16-2012, 07:46 PM
Last Post: Pluton
  Effect of attributes, washes and enchants on Damage Pluton 6 13 650 02-28-2012, 06:25 PM
Last Post: Pluton
  Hero Recruitment Fees and Faculty Increase Pluton 2 7 057 01-16-2012, 10:02 PM
Last Post: Pluton
  [Refining] Detailed Effect of All Traders [Updated] Pluton 3 8 488 11-19-2011, 08:02 PM
Last Post: Pluton
  General Damage Calculation Pluton 0 5 170 10-15-2011, 11:30 PM
Last Post: Pluton
  Effect of Morale on Damage! 100-202 morale Pluton 0 5 412 10-15-2011, 11:21 PM
Last Post: Pluton
  [Training] Detailed Effect of All Trainers Pluton 0 5 286 10-11-2011, 12:09 AM
Last Post: Pluton

  • View a Printable Version
  • Subscribe to this thread

  • Contact Us
  • Forum team
  • Forum stats
  • Return to Top
 
  • RSS Syndication
  • Lite mode
  • Ultimate Batheo Guide
  • Help
 
Forum software by © MyBB - Theme © iAndrew 2014



Linear Mode
Threaded Mode